Hebrews 10 -for Brian in Ireland
The following is in response to a question that Brian from Ireland gave in his comment a few days ago. I hope this is of help. His question was concerning the following verses.
Heb 10:26-31
26For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,
In the above verse the writer is talking about those who wanted to go back under the law. That is the “SIN”. There were some who had clearly accepted the understanding of the (new covenant) written about in the following verses and yet had begun to have doubts:
Heb 10:16-18
16 This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;
17 And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more.
18 Now where remission of these is, there is no more offering for sin.
The people in question needed to understand that the offering of sin had been made and there would not be any future offerings. The old offerings that they wanted to go back to under the law would not bring any peace to their minds. If they chose that the next verses describe the type of mindset they could look forward to.
27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.
The above verse describes exactly what the mind set after the flesh (law) can look forward to. I don’t believe the writer is stating what the reality is but rather what the illusion is for those who strive to be right with God by LAW.
28 He that despised Moses’ law died without mercy under two or three witnesses:
29 Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?
The writer here is making the case to those people who had tasted of this new covenant and then were reconsidering if it could really be true. How many times do Christians today doubt if God’s grace could really go the distance. “Where sin has gone GRACE has gone all the MORE.”Our doubting GRACE will never be able to change its POWER.
Heb 10:12
12 But this man, after he had offered one sacrifice for sins for ever, sat down on the right hand of God;
THE FORGIVENESS OF OUR SINS DOES NOT HAPPEN BECAUSE OF WHAT WE OFFER. IT HAPPENS BECAUSE OF WHAT HE OFFERED ONCE FOR ALL AND OUR DOUBTING IT WILL ONLY CAUSE US INWARD PAIN IN THIS LIFE THAT IS NOT NECESSARY. COMING OUT OF THAT DOUBT IS OUR SALVATION NOT OUR REDEMPTION.
30 For we know him that hath said, Vengeance belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people.
31 It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.
The writer above is quoting from the law. Certainly everyone who is trusting in following the law will lay their head down at night with extreme fear of falling into the hands of the God of LAW. Look at the definition of fearful in verse 31:
FEARFUL: foberos, fobera, foberon
1. (actively) inspiring fear, terrible, formidable
2. (passively) affected with fear, timid; Heb 10:27,31
Those who choose to go back and trust in the old system will be inspired by fear, affected with fear, and in constant torment of a vengeful God.But as we know, PERFECT LOVE CAST OUT ALL FEAR.
The writer of Hebrews is not speaking in these verses of the reality of God’s unconditional love seen in the sacrifice of Jesus. He is talking about the mind of a person who has been awakened to this love and then goes back and chooses the old life of Adam. That person will never have peace in his flesh. We have seen this in many a human being to this day, but the reality is that they have been set free and someday they will see the glory of their own creation and will bow down in utter praise to the God who loved them even before their journey on this earth began and will love them long after it is over.
Peace,
Cliff
“And here is a parable of life for you to ponder on: A group of tourists sits in a bus that is passing through gorgeously beautiful country; lakes and mountains and green fields and rivers. But the shades of the bus are pulled down. They do not have the slightest idea of what lies beyond the windows of the bus. And all the time of their journey is spent in squabbling over who will have the seat of honor in the bus, who will be applauded, who will be well considered. And so they remain til the journey’s end.”
By Anthony De Mello - The Way To Love
Sue, I think that speaks quite clearly to those who are not yet awakened to the confidence they could have if they would only open their hearts to the gospel of grace & peace. Thank you for a wonderful parable.
Wouldn’t be wonderful to have a New Testament written that would have a bible verse (thought) then what it means as you have done in your answer above? Have you ever thought of doing that Cliff? A very clear understanding for me - thankyou - Because he first loved us - Sue
Sue, I will be 57 in January and I have high hopes to go into at least part time retirement at age 62 and then I will have more time to devote to things like that. That also gives me 5 more years to learn from my fellow travelers on this great journey of life. It seems like since I have left the organized church and embraced complete freedom of thought that the scriptures have really come alive in ways I didn’t think possible. Also the thoughts of others have come alive, even those I disagree with I am able to learn things from. That’s what true freedom can do. Thanks again for your thoughts and encouragement.
Excellent post, Cliff. Thanks so much for the crystal clear understanding about what has always been a troubling passage. And I do agree with Sue that the format using the explanatory boxes really helps.
Hi again Cliff. I have recently been debating with a lady who is so dogmatic about certain scriptures that I have been getting a bit defensive with her…the spirit in which she used those scriptures really started to trigger me and I was taking it quite personal…anyway I spent time really asking why is she triggering me so and I realised she was mirroring a part of myself that was not totally convinced in the Gospel…I spent time really loving on myself and doing some of byron katies work on some of my unconscious beliefs and then when you answered my question from Hebrews my heart has come alive in new way which i very grateful for!! It has taken me 9 years to unlearn and unravel so much of my old beliefs that has kept my heart in fear but this is really huge. lol I am so grateful Now to this lady as she is was my gift in disquise! Brian
I used to struggle with those verses as a literalist, thinking if I didn’t believe in Jesus sacrifice enough (must not have because my behavior just didn’t seem to be changing enough for “righteousness sake”), I would have no other “option” if I was to look elsewhere(?), and damned am I.
Cliff, what about those of us who never adhered to the old system of sacrifice(literally), but adhered to the understanding of Jesus sacrifice(literally) and embraced it wholeheartedly, but have moved on from these concepts of yesteryear, to understand that Jesus didn’t die for sins, but because of sins, about Sin not being the offense to the ruling male diety in the sky, but being the deminishment of the lives of others, here, now(as that is all there ever really is).
Symbolically speaking Jesus is absolutely a symbol of salvation, one who loved so wastefully even the hardest of heart could not deny. God was in Christ, Christ pointed to God in us, this is the thrust, but to take as literally the one who takes away the sin of the world to appease bloodthirsty god just doesn’t jive in my heart anymore.
It surprises me how convinced I once was in such a concept. And please don’t try to say well, God gave us what we wanted concept, that just makes excuse for angry God and tiptoes around the glaring deficiency of believing God demanded the blood of animals and people in the first place.
So, I don’t mind saying I do not believe Jesus literally died for my sins, yet I experience the peace of God as I learn to breathe and walk in Christ conscience.
Christ points to God within, a realm to live out from that is unflappable, doctrines I once held couldn’t stand the heat of a consuming fire that is Being, there are no attachments, theism gets left behind (insert 2 men in the field parable here), I am learning it is not all about law and grace, there is so much more. Yet these are concepts that can help us understand the Christ nature, but without the religious trappings.
This is the journey I have experienced thus far, I have no desire to “push” only to share.
I am off for a few days to go hunting with some friends, I do not hunt but I can cook pretty good, I love this time of year, getting back to the “outback” is always refreshing, a few(+) cold ones and some friends to share them with is golden for sure.
In Christ,
Marco
Wonderful comment Marco…Very well constructed.
Marco,
Thank you for putting that into words. If we cannot take all the bible literally then how can we take any of it literally. Jesus taught in parables so I wonder if the story of Jesus could be told likewise? Just a thought.
Enjoy cooking for your friends! Because he first loved us - Sue
Very good article IMHO.
We could look at this as pertains to how the conscience will interpret the experiences that are about to be. A sort of alternative view of sorts is one that relates to the “conscience” in terms of “audience relevance”.
What the Hebrew writer is seeing before him is the visible ending of the law.
[Heb. 8:13 In that He says, “A new covenant,” He has made the first obsolete. Now what is BECOMING obsolete and GROWING old is READY to vanish away.]
1) The temple is about to be destroyed (Heb. 9:8) and those who follow Christ see it coming, and those who wish to return to the law are going to have to deal with it based upon their “conscience” of sins in a law mind-set.
2) The destruction of Jerusalem is about to take place (Heb. 13:14) and those whose conscience is fixed in law obedience will suffer in conscience.
In this way the Hebrew writer is warning of the consequence “in conscience” of what is about to take place. The law never make the “conscience” perfect. And the visible vanishing away of the temple, the sacrifices, and the Holy city as Jesus had specifically foretold, would have it’s final impact in conscience as they began to remember these warnings (Acts 6:13, 7:47-50), that being upon those who had been entrusted with types and figures.
In this way this was a specific warning for those who would continue in sin (”conscience” IE then “the law”) after receiving the knowledge of the truth of God in Christ Jesus.
At this time with the imminent end to the temple and the holy city these things had a special meaning IMHO.
Just a thought,
Barry
Sue- The conflict about how to see and read the Bible is the single greatest issue dividing Christians in North America today.There several different ways of seeing three foundational questions about the Bible: 1. questions about its origin, 2. its authority , 3. its interpretation. Your question seems to fall under the third question. If you see the Bible as inerrant and infallible, you probably feel the Bible is to be interpreted literally, UNLESS the language of a particular passage is clearly metaphorical. But how does the average reader know what’s literal and what’s metaphorical? Allowing nonliteral interpretation, to you, probably opens the door to evading the Bible’s authority and making it say what you want it to say. You most likely take the Bible with the utmost seriousness and find yourself wanting to criticize “liberals” for watering it down or for seeing too many metaphors.
I wish for you to see there is another way of thinking which is exemplified by a sizable group of Christians today whose numbers are increasing. These Christians are less clear about how they DO see the Bible than about how they DO NOT. They are strongly convinced that many parts of the Bible are not to be taken literally, either as historically factual or as expressing the “will of God”.This group, some within the church, some of which have left the church for various reasons, are responding positively to a more historical and metaphorical reading of the Bible. They see interpretation as moving beyond biblical literalism and make persuasive and compelling sense for that different way of seeing the Bible. I would invite you to take a look at this idea. I would recommend Marcus Borg’s “Reading the Bible Again for the First Time”.
Marco, I understand what you are saying. I also understand that a vast majority of today’s christians think from the mindset of traditional christianity and with my years of experience with that I am often able to speak to them on their terms. The bible is a wonderful book that has within it the hidden treasures of truth that I believe God wants us to find. Certainly His truths are not limited to the bible but in fact I believe He speaks to us literally thousands of ways that we are not even aware of. I know that you are on a great journey and I’m sure I will learn much from you but you must also remember that sometimes we must slow down for those who are not yet ready to be where we are.
Barry, Thanks so much for your thoughts on this.
Don R, Thanks also for your input. I am hoping to get the book you mentioned soon.
Don R, I’m sorry I was not clear about literalism - It was a statement not a question. I’m reading - Jesus Against Christianity-Reclaiming the Missing Jesus - this is after several books leaning this way - so I’m seeing the Bible in a different light than I did when I went to church many years ago. As a child I always had a hard time with the unfairness and cruelty so it has been a long journey to see God in a different light. When I was about 6 my family went to see the movie The Ten Commandments and I threw up when they were killing the babies and was taken home. My first baby died even though I was on the floor alone in the hospital praying for him to live so I’ve had a long conflict with the angry vengeful god compared to a God of Love. Along with the cruelty God dished out (and rightly so because God can do whatever he wants) were those around us - family and church members that controlled thru that same senario and of course using the hell concept. One such example was an Aunt sent me a “sympathy” card in which she wrote “God giveth and God taketh away, blest be the name of God.”! I did not like her or God much after that but was afraid of my feelings.
A God of hate and war etc. just doesn’t seem to correspond with A God of Love, Peace and Grace. I will get the book you mentioned and thank you so much for your comments.
All: Even though I “understand” Grace I cannot say that I have or feel Euphoria or tremendous peace that you all say you have. Depression does not go away. What have I missed? I do not think I am stupid and even if I am stupid I know God still loves me etc., but I still feel lost or hungry with a supposed feast in front of me. Logic and truth are important to me - sometimes they seem elusive and the lie. Perhaps I think too much as I sound crazy - Dive In! Because he first loved us - Sue
Sue, Sometimes people who suffer from depression simply have a chemical imbalance and no truth in the world can bring them peace. I don’t know your situation but I have loved ones that are now enjoying great peace after they were able to get help with proper medication. As I said before, God speaks to us in a thousand different ways and sometimes it is through the help of a good Doctor. If none of this applies to you then please disregard, but if it does then please seek help. If you want to call me I would be glad to talk to you about this in more depth. E-mail me at cliff@boldgrace.com and I will send you my phone number.
Peace,
Cliff
Sue when Kate and I left the organized church, we said to the Lord “give us the mountains” the neglected, depressed the ones churches pushed aside because they thought they had no value. Well they came to us, they lived with us at times, we fed them, gave financially, it was such a pleasure. We never told people to go off medication or told them to just jump out of it. Sue lets bypass the mind, lets clear the table of past and future. Because most people are depressed because of regrets of the past and fear of the future, what ifs rule there lives. We never go into anyones past, no inner healings, churches are trying to fix the Old Man,when that old nature is dead. You do not have dual natures, you are not good and evil, “You Are LIFE” if we let imaginations in they are just illusions.
Well how do we fix the mind? We don’t, do not get involved in processes they will wear you out. For a start ,kick trying to get self esteem out the door, kick trying to live up to expectations of others and especially your self out. GOD ACCEPTS YOU, you have been accepted into the beloved, no trying just rest. Stop trying to climb the mountain you have been placed on the top, its a different view in Christ.
Every person who comes to us, we tell them there true identity, you have been born again of an incorruptible seed, it cannot be corrupted it is all powerful and it is fruitful. And it is naturally who you really are, He that is joined to the Lord is one Spirit,the word joined means glued, inseparable. You are One with the Father His Kingdom of Righteousness, Peace and Joy is in through and around you. There is no judgment on you, You are free. Now you are the clay He is the potter, what can the clay do. Any process is His problem, its His Faith not yours. Rest in who you really are Sue and let God prove Himself. We are seeing people finally free of illusions and mind games including ourselves and we didn’t even try. I find this Life in Him easy and cruisy, and naturally spiritual. Sue you are home, clear the table of trying. You are of the order of Melchizedek in the Kingdom of Righteousness and Peace. You are so accepted By the Father Sue
Love Jeff and Kate.
Sue- Thanks for your clarification. Sorry that I misread what you said. I, too, have had a family member who suffered with depression. It is not an easy path. Blessings to you.
All: Thank you all for your love. I have been down the medication path but I respond the opposite of the intended outcome - I become violent and more depressed so I have learned to live with this malady. I also am ACUTELY aware that my affliction is small compared to a large portion of the people on this planet. I would not trade my dis-ease for many others out there. I did not mean to come across as complaining or so pitiful, although as I have many times said to my husband it would be nice to wake up and feel positive instead of gloomy.
There is always a problem with enlightenment or an answer. While the Grace concept is beautiful it still raises other questions. If the plan of God is that GRACE is redemption (new life after death) and the knowledge of that grace is salvation, then anyone that doesn’t have a good brain, anyone that is ill, those that live short human lives, those that are in captivity of any sort are out of luck for salvation. How is that any more fair or different than traditional christianity. Isn’t natures natural selection of all things thereby a respector of persons where salvation is concerned? Why do most people live in poverty both of physical need and LOVE? Why is this “journey” we speak of a journey of hell for most people? We don’t know for sure there is life after death unless we have a faith. Why would a loving God make us go thru such torment and death in the first place? Perhaps depression does cloud my understanding and perhaps it keeps telling me there are no answers. I cling to “because he first loved us” as I have never felt I belonged anywhere. (I grew up in a family and I have a family) but have felt only loved if I first loved - maybe this is the human condition - Because he first loved us - Sue
Sue, you have many people surrounding you with their love and giving you encouragement as you journey along. Obviously your family is there for you too. But really, YOU are the one with all the answers for Sue. It is all within you - all that happiness and joy and peace that you long for, you’ve been carrying it round with you all the time. Try changing your focus from outside of you to deep inside you - that is where the river is. The REAL you is prefectly whole and you won’t have to cling on to anything, including that repetative phrase you sign your name with. Let’s see the REAL Sue without all those trappings. You’ll be amazed at how beautiful she is. Keep digging deeper, she’s a precious jewel waiting to be uncovered!
Sue- I think I see a problem with the word “salvation” (saved). Take a look at a post a friend did some time ago and see what it says to you.
http://donrogers.org/?p=114
Audrey, I know you mean well and have told me this before but it is chinese to me. How is this done? Do I ask myself a question and then answer? If I need to learn geometry I need someone to teach me, I just don’t get what you and others of boldgrace are saying.
DonR, I think it is saying salvation is always a work in progess, always learning but that does not answer why some peoples journey is hell and other peoples is a stroll in the park.
Because he first loved us - Sue
Hi Sue,
You have children and I can tell you are very fond of children. All you do is be like one of those, completely open and honest. It’s a different way of thinking, called metanoia, where you firstly deliberately TURN FROM, - rebel against the taught way of thinking i.e. how society, religion and education has trained you to think, and instead open your heart and wait trusting like a child. Soon some stirrings will be felt deep inside. You will be able to put these into words. Speak them out aloud, you are connecting to the spirit, and I promise you, you will start to see the REAL Sue.
Quote:
Sueon 11 Nov 2008 at 1:11 pm link comment
All: Thank you all for your love. I have been down the medication path but I respond the opposite of the intended outcome - I become violent and more depressed so I have learned to live with this malady. I also am ACUTELY aware that my affliction is small compared to a large portion of the people on this planet. I would not trade my dis-ease for many others out there. I did not mean to come across as complaining or so pitiful, although as I have many times said to my husband it would be nice to wake up and feel positive instead of gloomy.
There is always a problem with enlightenment or an answer. While the Grace concept is beautiful it still raises other questions. If the plan of God is that GRACE is redemption (new life after death) and the knowledge of that grace is salvation, then anyone that doesn’t have a good brain, anyone that is ill, those that live short human lives, those that are in captivity of any sort are out of luck for salvation. How is that any more fair or different than traditional christianity. Isn’t natures natural selection of all things thereby a respector of persons where salvation is concerned? Why do most people live in poverty both of physical need and LOVE? Why is this “journey” we speak of a journey of hell for most people? We don’t know for sure there is life after death unless we have a faith. Why would a loving God make us go thru such torment and death in the first place? Perhaps depression does cloud my understanding and perhaps it keeps telling me there are no answers. I cling to “because he first loved us” as I have never felt I belonged anywhere. (I grew up in a family and I have a family) but have felt only loved if I first loved - maybe this is the human condition - Because he first loved us - Sue
End quote.
Sue, a few thoughts love if you don’t mind.
God is first and foremost a “Creator”.
Now God is love of course. And this has something to say about “creation”. But we tend to look at things with both limited and short vision.
Here is what I think:
Love more than anything else wishes to share. Share too fast and you will get a “Babel”.
In essence then we may be trying to impose limited concepts of “good and evil” on God. Notice that this is the very thing that God said, “do not eat”.
Now we kinda know what is loving and what isn’t in some ways. Sure! Like burning someone in hell for all eternity just of the hell of it. Don’t make any sense at all really. And we do have very good answers for what these judgment verses really were referring too IMHO. [And they do not refer to post-mortem eternal torment.]
But that doesn’t mean that we don’t have some deeper considerations to think about when we are dealing with the LONG TERM implications of love and creation. If God want to share with his “offspring” then it’s going to take time and it’s not always going to be a walk in the “garden”. And that IMO is why God put the tree of the knowledge of good and evil in front of Adam and Eve.
It’s not really a story about how humanity got screwed up, but about what it takes to understand that we did not make ourselves, and so then how much God REALLY loves us and wants to share of his divine nature. And also what the long term meaning of that sharing implies.
If you made a computer that worked perfectly you would have made one that cannot learn beyond its perfect programing. It would do some things perfectly but could go no further.
If you made one kinda stupid and could make mistakes then it could learn and extend its applications and processes in time.
When you are dealing with children you have to talk and communicate with children. When they start growing up you can reveal more to them. It doesn’t make you a liar, it makes you a loving Father. How could we [historically speaking] understand love without condition without first obtaining a conditions mentality.
I think that God is very much a all loving God. But I also think that He sees enough that He saw a need to sacrifice on one hand to obtain greater things as time goes on.
I cannot image a God that does not want to share with His offspring. Offspring is a big word. Cats don’t have puppies if you know what I mean. So what does it mean that we are the offspring of God? [rhetorical]
Jesus taught us something very important. As hard as it gets at times we know through Him where we came from and where we are going. And so we can live in the “now” and make the most of whatever stewardship we are given.
God has His agenda IMHO and it is love focused. While our eternal security is established or revealed in Christ, and is not in question, we are still a part of a long term love based sharing agenda.
This is what fulfillment speaks of IMHO. The fulfillment of types and figures is not just an end [of the old], but a new beginning where eternal security is no longer the question but rather the answer.
We are IMO now learning how much we are all in this together. Sometimes we will feel elated and sometimes we will feel down. And that is nothing to be ashamed of. We don’t need to pile shame on top of momentary discouragement. But IMHO it can help to know that we are part of an important agenda of God’s desire to share. And that is because of His love.
Just my personal opinion.
Love Barry
That’s why I love this site……so many with so much make us all a little richer as thoughts are freely given in love.
Sue- I think this link might help. It is a site that has answered some of my questions before.
http://www.explorefaith.org/world.html
ALL: You have given me much to think about, and I thank you so much. Your love pouring out to me reminds me of an experience I had in good old Walmart a few weeks ago:
I saw a beautiful little girl about 3 years old with naturally curly golden blonde hair with a cherub face and a smile that made me laugh with joy. I was telling her I loved her hair and how pretty she was when I saw her mother & exchanged a few words about this lovely child. Then I noticed an older girl who was plain looking about 8 yrs. old slightly behind same mother and she was looking at me, and her eyes had a fearful, longing look. I said hi cutey pie and asked her a couple ?’s about herself she smiled and her eyes lit up & revealed such beauty, she seemed so pleased to be noticed. I felt I could see deep in her soul looking into her eyes. I guess my point is if we take the time to notice, all are beautiful and in need of notice.
Wow, this story from Sue about the two little girls is so rich.
There are so many that are like the little 8 year old and they need to hear how precious they are especially in then sight of the Father. In God’s eyes we are all as beautiful as the little one but this world that so frequently focuses only on the outer deprives many of the great riches that lies within. So they hide in fear behind misconceptions.
May they receive the help they desperately need so that their mind may be changed and they may blossom into the true son & daughter of God that they really are.
I sometimes wonder if one of the greatest ways to worship the Father is in giving the tremendous worth to His children that they hold in His eyes.
The way I see it, the world is constantly telling us that we are NOT beautiful, precious, and perfect. But, if we will trust ourselves for a moment, and listen from deep inside our hearts, we will sense a smiling, loving Father who sees us without fault. If we live in the “world”, there is no doubt that we will be torn down and defeated. But, if we can begin to move in the spirit… the kingdom of heaven, where perfection reigns, we will be lifted up above the world.
We can’t blame the world though for being so destructive. It is simply doing what it was created to do. And as we learn to overcome its destructiveness, we will be doing what we were created to do.
We need to stop seeing ourselves as human beings striving for a spiritual experience, but instead see ourselves as spiritual beings having a (temporary) earthly experience. As we wander through this illusion of physical reality (remember, everything you think is real, is actually just whirling spheres of energy… ask Einstein), let’s focus on what is true… the Spirit of God within each of us. We are made of His Spirit Life, and cannot be separated from it. The physical world is not real, only “life” is. And “life” is only made of spirit.
Hey, I haven’t been back on this site in quite a while because of school. Reading all of these comments is such an encouragement especially dealing with daily challenges of living on my own for the first time and balancing my schoolwork.
Bruce, if you don’t mind me asking, can you clarify what you mean when you say this physical world is not real? Thanks
Kiara, everything we think is real is actually made up of tiny particles of energy. The science of quantum physics explains it very well, and there are some good articles out there that can shed some light on the subject. Check google for some good insights. Careful though, it could change everything you think about reality!
Here’s a good video:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-1406370011028154810
I am in a discussion group at church on Wed. night, reading through the book “Divine Nobodies” by Jim Palmer. We had a conversation last night that is related to what you guys have been talking about - real vs. unreal. Jim was describing a spiritual experience he had, which precipitated members of the group describing their own experiences. It was all quite interesting, and what struck me was, after one guy described what he had experienced, he said something like this: “I had a feeling of overwhelming love and complete peace - which lasted all of about 10 seconds. But, that was enough! In a sense, it has stayed with me ever since.”
I think it’s largely a matter of what we choose to focus on. That guy could have dismissed what happened to him as his mind playing tricks on him, or just experienced it for the moment. Instead, that became a turning point for him. We have the choice - do we focus on the physical aspects of our existence to the exclusion of the spiritual? If we do, we miss out on what makes life most meaningful.
(I plan to watch that video, Bruce, when I have more time. Looks quite intriguing!)
Connie, Thanks for sharing that. It is so nice to hear about christians who are willing to open up in a group setting and share their honest hearts with each other, especially on controversial subjects.
Thanks for the link Bruce. I’ll check it out when I have more time. I think Connie also has a good point about what we choose to focus on determines how we percieve things. I remember having an interesting conversation with a classmate from philosophy class last spring about whether we pre-existed before this physical life or not. Anyone have any thoughts on this matter?
Gee, Kiara. I don’t have a clue. There is so much about the spirit realm we can’t understand, but I’m sure someday we will. As the mystery unfolds, I think we will be blown away with the whole thing!
I wonderful if Paul had his open to the wonderful universe of pure love and grace he said he was in the third heaven.Bruce i watch the video and I thought about how God has perfect order to His universe and He has no being or on end and we just begining to see the way things really are.
Paul said we see threw the glass darkly especaily when we look threw the law of the commandments.Paul saw threw a much greater law of love and mercy and want so much for others to see this law of love and mercy for all.
In Hebrews it says that God put His laws in our hearts and minds I wonder when we just sit still and meditate and His love and mercy we travel threw the universe of love and mercy.
Love in Christ Dan
Bruce, I am going to view that video as well. Thanks!
DonR - I am exploring the site you suggested; explorefaith.org - Thank you also.
Because he first loved us - Sue
Barry, Thank you for your thoughtful opinion. - Because he first loved us - Sue